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I am a believer in the more constant you're constants are the better and more consistent you're shooting will be!
So basically what your saying is that 98/99 percent of all cartridges using smokeless powder have an air gap as hand loaders only acount for roughly 5 percent of ammunition .produced in this country. And only a small percentage of those powders shown in published data recommend compressed loads. Looking back over 35 years of hand loading personally and commercially I can't remember but one or two combinations that were more accurate or velocity stable with compressed loads most ended up wantingJohn. I don't think I agree too much with your comments about smokeless rifle cartridges having an air space. It's probable that most factory loaded cartridges do have an air space between powder and bullet, But a lot of cartridges are handloaded with slight compression. I know not all are loaded with compression, but MANY are. And my black powder cartridges in 38-55 want no air space. Old 45 Colt revolvers cylinders blew up when there was an air space between powder and bullets, so I know theres some concern for safety with this issue. Sometimes a filler above the powder is used, or wads. But I do agree that a breech plug designed to stop a bullet at a consistent depth is an idea worth experimenting with. You're the machinist. Go for it. Talk to Ninering about it. He loves this stuff too.
Sounds like it should do the job.I ordered a $3.00 aluminum stop collar to put on my ramrod. My thinkin is the collar, held in place and easily adjusted by a set screw, will be attached where my witness mark is. After my powder is dumped in and I ram my bullet and sabot down to make contact with the powder, I would set the collar, maybe just .01" further down and presumably this would be giving me uniform and consistent seating compression. I'd fiddle with the .01" increment and let group size dictate what amount of compression is best.
Every time I change bullet or powder charge the set collar would need to be adjusted, so this isn't necessarily great when doing load development, but once my load is determined, then the collar is set.
Does this sound feasible? Would signficant changes in daily temperature, or barrel temperature make this fail? It seems so simple I can't believe I haven't seen or heard of this. Maybe somebody has already proven this idea to be no good.
I must admit looking back at my previous post it does look defensive.Most experience hand loaders and target shooters I know that are shooting what we would refer to as a compressed load are looking for velocity, and yes sometimes there is an accurate node in a compressed load. However many times those hot compressed loads are hard on brass and do not make near as much sense to me as a load that's between 85 to 95% density that's just what I prefer myself, I do not shoot compressed loads in any of my hand loaded cartridges ppc,br,308 creedmoors Etc. I really think looking at this subject that everyone is right to some degree ,it really depends on the shooters application and what the shooter is looking for, now I asked for it being something to try and a Muzzleloader I mean a slight air gap I cannot speak to that myself what if that little air gap at the base made bullet swell better, again when we hear the word air gap I think all of our hair stand up and we don't quite understand what GA is getting at. Interesting topic I think and I enjoy the different perspectives and input GA makes me think about things I haven't thought about and I like that!!
Do you have any veggie wads that you can try?........This held true in using a wad several times by adding a wad and giving a decompressionable quality to the charge colum gave lower velocities.
Remove the wad with no other changes velocity went back up.
Thr flip side was that SDS were better as a general rule with a wad.
I hypothesis that the wad gave enough cushion to even out the compression shot to shot........
Some benchrest shootersI believe it’s important to consider the potential variations in settling of your powder charge from load to load. Since this is the SML forum, for example with IMR 4198, I notice that a 57 grain charge will settle considerably. Here is a comparison of the height of a “poured” 57 gr charge vs a “tapped” (settled) 57 gr charge. My procedure is to lightly tap the barrel 10 times before seating the bullet to attempt to achieve a little more consistency.
View attachment 42833
I don't have any veggiesDo you have any veggie wads that you can try?
I've not yet started shooting smokeless, but I found if you double up a veggie wad, it'll increase the velocity by approximately 80fps when shooting BH.
I do however like the most velocity I can accurately achieve in almost any hunting situation.Some benchrest shooters
I don't have any veggies
My goal is not necessarily to increase velocity.
My goal is to find the most accuracy in a given velocity range
in short and mid range velocity doesn't matter as much as say what your doing at 1000 and beyond.
Velocity might become a factor latter..
Did that target show up yet??I do however like the most velocity I can accurately achieve in almost any hunting situation.
Haven't seen it in the snail mail.Did that target show up yet??
That's what the discussion is all aboutI wasn't offended. I just left home for a few hours and wasn't able to carry on the discussion. And I do like long descriptive narratives. Especially if you proofread your typing errors. ( hint : Mark)
I bought the $3.00 aluminum collars off Amazon. I don't have a photo cuz I'm an ignoramus with computers (but I do proofread).
As for my goals with the collar, It's not necessarily to get an increase in velocity by compressing the powder, it's an attempt to get consistency in seating force pressure, which I assume has to give better accuracy. Whether the powder is compressed or not isn't my concern, just that the seating force is consistent without buying an expensive gauge. Maybe a little compression gives that consistency. Hell, I don't know anything yet. The collars haven't even arrived in the mail. I wanna aim for the bullseye and hit it. I want all 5 bullets in a group to hit the same hole. I love 1/4 inch groups. There's not enough recoil with my Paramount to be concerned with, but when I get my Patriot I'm gonna be lookin for a low recoil, i.e. light bullet, low velocity, smokeless, load that shoots the eye off a flys head. I DON'T like the "term minute of deer, 3" group at 100 yds is good enough". Pie plates are not targets. 1/4" dots are! Maybe a little bigger if I use a peep sight. I want the groups that win the postal match, eh!
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