Knight rifles ceasing?

[flounder]

I think Knight's biggest problem has been marketing. I personally don't have a problem with shooting 777 or pyrodex or real black powder for that matter. I have shot BH 209 through my disc rifles without a hitch but I don't see as much of an advantage to it as some have claimed. As long as I can hit what I'm aiming at I don't feel at any great disadvantage using black powder or one of the other substitutes. I can shoot game and have as much fun at the range as the BH 209 shooters. As someone said it is all about public perception and somehow this is where Knight needs to change things.
My brother has been shooting the Omega and really felt it cleaned up a lot easier than my guns until he discovered the mess he had behind his firing pin. I kind of like the idea of being able to easily get at the parts that need cleaning and clean them every time I shoot rather than have them hidden, only to cause problems down the road.
Don't get me wrong, I think T/C has excellant products but their real accomplishment has been in the marketing department.
I feel confident that Knight Rifles will continue to operate. It might be an excellent opportunity for someone to buy them out and keep the company going.
Sorry for the rambling but I have been thinking about this and am trying to put it in writing.
Art

 

[black powder]

no your not rambling at all ..my ENCORE also has a lot of mess behind the firing pin ,but it is very easy to clean [only one allen cap scew to remove] but T-C did they're homework ,and came out with a new BREECHPLUG no more fowling or blowback ..

 

[Emptypockets]

I don't mean to be mean spirted here, so please don't take it that way, but, that Shadow is just flat ugly. I have never taken a second look at it. But that is just me. But I think that you could have a rifle that shot fairly well but was very far from pretty and it would not sell as well as say----- an Encore. Think cars and motorcycles or whatever. I have a gun or two that I just love, one that I have NEVER shot, but it is in my house because it pleases me just to look at it. I'm not saying that it is all about style or whatever, but some things just go beyond function. And some don't. And that is alright as far as I'm concerned. I just would hate to see Knight not making guns anymore. Some guns are just more fun to carry in the woods than others. Design is not every thing by any means. I really like their rolling block, but I have never shot one. Hows that for a ramble? No offence meant to anyone.

 

[choc-dog]

no your not rambling at all ..my ENCORE also has a lot of mess behind the firing pin ,but it is very easy to clean [only one allen cap scew to remove] but T-C did they're homework ,and came out with a new BREECHPLUG no more fowling or blowback ..

Ken French retired 3 years ago but he still shows up and the plant every week. Ken was behind many of T/C inovations. Now Ken son Earny has taken over the helm and the newer breech plugs and Triumpth are his.

Some of his design team young women....go figure.

Chocdog

 

[choc-dog]

no your not rambling at all ..my ENCORE also has a lot of mess behind the firing pin ,but it is very easy to clean [only one allen cap scew to remove] but T-C did they're homework ,and came out with a new BREECHPLUG no more fowling or blowback ..

Erney French has taken over were his dad Ken French left off when Ken retired 3 years ago. Many of the new features and products are Earny work.

Some of Erney design team are women.....go figure.

Chocdog

 

[coltchris]

I talked to Gordie at Knight Rifles yesterday about some primers not firing in my grandson's Vision. I told him "I hope some of the rumors I'm hearing about Knight are not true". He didn't deny the rumors and stated that maybe they would have to scale back and become smaller in this economy. I wished him the best and stated that we on MM sure didn't want to see them go. He thanked me; but Vision firing problem not resolved (it fires Fed 209A & Rem STS fine, but not Win 209's; go figure, as the Win's are longer!)

 

[sabotloader]

coltchris

but Vision firing problem not resolved (it fires Fed 209A & Rem STS fine, but not Win 209's; go figure, as the Win's are longer!)

I just sent a Vision into knight to get it repaired for the same thing. Did they request you to send yours in?

The 'problem' is the sliding locking lug in the trigger assembly. The sliding lugs serves a dual purpose, not only does it lock the action up - it also cocks the hammer. The problem occurs when it does not slide on to the locking lug on the barrel far enough (deep enough). When this happens it will not allow the hammer to fall complet flat onto the firing pin. It is a realtive easy problem to fix and might accomplished in a couple of different methods. Since the Vision I had was brand new thought I would have them fix that and hopefully some trigger creep.

 

[Busta]

coltchris

but Vision firing problem not resolved (it fires Fed 209A & Rem STS fine, but not Win 209's; go figure, as the Win's are longer!)

I just sent a Vision into knight to get it repaired for the same thing. Did they request you to send yours in?

The 'problem' is the sliding locking lug in the trigger assembly. The sliding lugs serves a dual purpose, not only does it lock the action up - it also cocks the hammer. The problem occurs when it does not slide on to the locking lug on the barrel far enough (deep enough). When this happens it will not allow the hammer to fall complet flat onto the firing pin. It is a realtive easy problem to fix and might accomplished in a couple of different methods. Since the Vision I had was brand new thought I would have them fix that and hopefully some trigger creep.

coltchris & sabotloader,

If the "problem" is what sabotloader states, then that would stand to reason why coltchris is having problems with the longer primers. If the longer primers are preventing the rifle fom locking up completely, the hammer would not be allowed to fall all the way, leaving light strikes on the firing pin.

.001" to .002" too much can be enough to drastically change lockup in a tip up rifle. The primer lengths can range from .005" to .010" and more from one brand to another, and easily up to .005" on primers from the same box. If the mechanism is designed as sabotloader states, this is where the "go figure" would come into play.

If you are using the teflon tape and rolling it over the face of the breech plug, this can add a couple thousandths to the headspace, thus creating a longer lock-up length. Add a few long primers to the mix, and I would say this is where your problem could be. Maybe, try tightening the breech plug down a hair tighter? It don't take much of a turn to equal a thousandth or two. Some experimentation should be able to prove or disprove this theory?

 

[coltchris]

Strangely enough, Gordie at Knight said they use Win. primers in testing and ask me to try them!!! At the time I called him, I wasn't sure which primers wouldn't fire. He did ask me to send the rifle back if the Win. primers wouldn't fire. I'm going to fool with it a bit to see if I can correct w/o altering any parts. If not, I'll send it in as I don't want to void Grandson's warranty.

 

[sabotloader]

Busta

Mine was so bad if you did not slam the gun together, even with out a primer the hammer would hit the lug and never make the firing pin. You could actually see the hammer contact try to close the action as it hit the moving lock up lug.

 

[hakx]

Knight should stick with what they know. Disc rifles were their bread and butter, and they SET the standard for modern inlines. I doubt they are out of the picture, but anticipate they would probably restructure.

 

[JimG]

This truly is heartbreaking for me. Me and the neighbor both love our Knight Extremes. I feel Knight screwed themselves by not pushing the Extreme hard enough. No marketing at all.

 

[Bucker]

knights

Man you look on Gun Broker and the bottom fell out on Knight rifle prices. If you boys want em. go over as they selling fairly cheap IMO> I almost was taked into an Extreme, but got the TC Pro Hunter. I hate any company going down, especially a ML company.

 

[flounder]

I see Knight is having an auction for some equipment and inventory in Centerville. Here is a link to the sale bill http://www.hawkeyetrader.com/content/view/4772/58/
Art

 

[coop2564]

I hope that is all this rumor is about, several have said they have done this before to get rid of old inventory!

 

[coltchris]

Been trying to get ahold of Knight re: Vision FTF problem and cannot get anything but answering machines!! Left messages with no returns so far. Talked to them last week, but cannot get them now! Hope its just extended holiday.

 

[sabotloader]

coltchris

I am a bit concerned also - I just set them a brand new Vision that will not shoot the primers.... Hope I do not loose it...

 

[rt_con]

I sent 2 barrelled actions to have the quick release installed.. week before last. I then called Knight Tech Support twice last week. Got the " due to call volumes.. please try later". Next time I just hung on the line, and a nice lady answered both times and connected me to Gordy (Tech Support).

Gordy called me back last Thursday to say my guns are done and he is sending them back. Then he said "Does that Elite .45 shoot OK ?" Yeah... why ? "The barrel looks like it was a bend in it". My jaw just about hit the floor. Then he starts laughing.. and says "I"m just having some fun with you man!"

We had a nice talk for about 10 mins about BH209 loads in the Disc rifles...he was in real a good mood. I didn't mention about the Knight Internet talk... but he seemed confident Knight was getting it's act together and was hopeful the new rifle will be a winner (next year). Just hope he's not totally blind slided.

 

[Busta]

Been trying to get ahold of Knight re: Vision FTF problem and cannot get anything but answering machines!! Left messages with no returns so far. Talked to them last week, but cannot get them now! Hope its just extended holiday.

I just talked to them yesterday, but Gordy (Gordie)? wasn't there. You have to know how to work the phone system. Things have changed since talking to them last week. Last week the phones would go directly to Customer Service. I am sure they have been getting bombarded with calls about the possible shut down, the phone system will weed out most. The new path will take you to 1) for Knight Rifles or 2) for Summit Tree Stands or vice versa. But if you navigate the right path through the phone system, you will get to talk to real live people. Or, just use the extension posted below.

Knight Rifles Customer Service
1-800-696-1703 Ext 2101

 

[coltchris]

Busta:

Just tried again and used Ext. 2101; still same results!! Could only get answering machine, left message for Gordy to call me. Hope it works as I've got grandson's Vision all packaged and ready to ship. Just wanted to check and see if I needed a ROA# and be sure I had the correct address.