Cabelas won't sell the Savage smokeless?

[toto]

Just wondering what the deal is. I went to Cabelas and they said they don't carry the savage smokeless because it isn't safe. I'd understand if this was bob and joes gun shop, but we are talking Cabelas, the king of the outdoors...

 

[sheephunterab]

Just wondering what the deal is. I went to Cabelas and they said they don't carry the savage smokeless because it isn't safe. I'd understand if this was bob and joes gun shop, but we are talking Cabelas, the king of the outdoors...

Was that told to you in an official Cabela's statement or was it a clerk that possibly wasn't aware of corporate policy? Just curious as it's not uncommon for employees to have views that differ from those of the corporation.

 

[toto]

just a clerk and who knows if those are Cabelas actual beliefs, but why wouldn't they carry it?

 

[sheephunterab]

just a clerk and who knows if those are Cabelas actual beliefs, but why wouldn't they carry it?

Certainly there are a large number of reasons why Cabela's choses to carry or not carry a certain item but volume and profit margin are the two biggest factors I'm sure.

 

[Anonymous]

but we are talking Cabelas, the king of the outdoors...

Wow. :shock: The King?

I'm not sure how many times you need to post the same thing, but do you think your clerk is more proficient in firearms knowledge than Accurate Arms powder company, multiple patent holder Henry Ball, Savage CEO Ron Coburn, Barnes bullets, the staff of Shooting Times, etc., etc.? Half as proficient? 10%? 1%?

The integrity, ruggedness, and overbuilt design of the 10ML-II is tested every single time an owner negligently shoots out a 1360 grain ramrod on top of a 300 grain bullet--------- projectile weight in excess of 1660 grains. No less than five people that have obtained their 10ML-II's from me have done this, and MANY more that picked up their Savages from other sources. Despite this overt, ridiculous, negligent overcharge-- not one has come apart.

Would you shoot a cleaning rod out of .30-06?

 

[toto]

I have no idea the knowledge level of the clerk, but Cabelas corporate obviously made the decision not to carry the Savage smokeless. I'd have to think they do have some very knowledgeable gun experts among the thousands of employees and management. They make a business by having everything possible for the outdoorsman and it has to do with more than profit margins or not having the knowledge I'm quite sure.

I think the concern from what I've been hearing may be the ease of double/triple charging with smokeless and the danger associated with that. vs. double charging black powder but I'm not sure.

no reason to get all bent out of shape, just telling you what the clerk had said. They are turning away a lot of buyers, I can guarantee you that. My father-in-law was in the market and after asking them about smokeless, went with the Knight. I'm now in the same position and leaning against smokeless based on some of this. The other big question, is why don't Knight, T/C and others go smokeless if this is so much better? They obviously have the resources and money to do this if they wanted to..

 

[Anonymous]

They make a business by having everything possible for the outdoorsman and it has to do with more than profit margins or not having the knowledge I'm quite sure.

Then, you are quite naive. Profit margins is why they exist, period. :!:

Money is why they floated shares of stock in July 2004, which spiked over $28. Right now it trades at under $17, symbol CAB.

 

[toto]

fine if you want to play this off as poor profit margins. For all anyone knows that could be the reason, who knows... If the gun is as good as they say and one of the only with that technology, profit margins should be quite high.

why didn't Knight and T/C jump in on smokeless if it is so much better??

 

[Anonymous]

fine if you want to play this off as poor profit margins. For all anyone knows that could be the reason, who knows... If the gun is as good as they say and one of the only with that technology, profit margins should be quite high.

why didn't Knight and T/C jump in on smokeless if it is so much better??

As for Knight and T/C, you can ask them.

As for the quality and performance of the Savage 10ML-II, there are many FAR more qualified people to get your information from than a retail store clerk-- many right here on this forum: Ron Name, Joe Name, Del Ramsey, Bill Ball, etc. There is good reason it is now in its 6th year of production, with no end in sight.

You can also ask Doc White, the senior ballisticians at Alliant and Accurate Powders, Barnes Bullets, or try to understand that the Savage 10ML-II is the only muzzleloader ever made that exceeds ALL applicable SAAMI, ANSI, and CIP specs including the 100% proof-testing of barrels.

It is built to a standard with 300% the service factor of most center fires, proven to withstand 129,000 PSI in torture testing-- while no Savage recommended service load exceeds 35,000 PSI.

If a clerk cannot comprehend the 10ML-II, he will have even greater difficulty understanding a 20 ga. shotgun.
:shock:

 

[sheephunterab]

fine if you want to play this off as poor profit margins. For all anyone knows that could be the reason, who knows... If the gun is as good as they say and one of the only with that technology, profit margins should be quite high.

why didn't Knight and T/C jump in on smokeless if it is so much better??

Smokeless definately has its advantages but right now it's a pretty small part of the market. I'm certain if that market continues to grow that other companies will look at it as well. This really is a game of making money and right now smokeless is a niche market that was more easily filled by a company like Savage that didn't have their production facilities tied up with traditional muzzleloaders, plus they had some awesome engineers and experts with a vision.

 

[toto]

thanks for the info. guys! I'll dig some more on the savage on this site, sounds like a great gun. There is a lot of knowledge on this site!

 

[Underclocked]

I have one of my 1/4-baked ideas about this. The Savage being as unique in the ml world as it is, might be more of a headache to a big outfit like Cabela's than it would be worth for them to sell it. Where would they put it.....in with other muzzleloaders where it might cause confusion and result in one of the ignorant masses putting smokeless in one of their rifles other than the Savage.....or over with the centerfires where it doesn't belong either? Hardly an insurmountable concern but maybe they see it as otherwise.

Either way, I don't see it as a major obstacle for sales of the Savage or Cabela's. Cabela's safety contention might simply be a ploy to sell what they DO carry. ??

Seems to me "some" of the boys here are just as fanatical about their views on the Savage as the radical traditionalists are in theirs.

My head hurts.

 

[sheephunterab]

From what I know of Cabela's....if they can sell enough of them and make enough of a margin, they will, whatever it is.

 

[Anonymous]

Seems to me "some" of the boys here are just as fanatical about their views on the Savage as the radical traditionalists are in theirs.

My head hurts.

Neither of which approach the irration exuberance of "some" of the White boys. uke:

Lord have mercy.

 

[sheephunterab]

Seems to me "some" of the boys here are just as fanatical about their views on the Savage as the radical traditionalists are in theirs.

My head hurts.

Neither of which approach the irration exuberance of "some" of the White boys. uke:

Lord have mercy.

Hey, I was just thinking that but I thought some were darned close...maybe a couple are even more over the top. Glad I drive a Ford because it's the best truck in the world...oh ya, my Nikon camera is the best too and all others are crap. Then there's my Nike runners and my Joe Boxer underwear....blah....blah....blah

 

[omega]

I Where would they put it.....in with other muzzleloaders where it might cause confusion and result in one of the ignorant masses putting smokeless in one of their rifles other than the Savage.....or over with the centerfires where it doesn't belong either?

I think though you may have hit on the reason why no ML manufacturer currently producing smokers is building a smokeless. The chance for confusion is pretty high when all too many hunters are lucky if they know they have a Knight or TC etc, let alone what model they have. Savage was very smart in how they entered the market with their first and only ML being a smokeless. They saw the opportunity to fill a niche and have done it well.
As far as Cabela's goes I'm sure when the sales are there they'll know what a smokeless ML is.

 

[Admin]

Seems to me "some" of the boys here are just as fanatical about their views on the Savage as the radical traditionalists are in theirs.

Yep. There's radicals in every group who think their way is best. White Boys, savage boys, traditionalists, T/C nuts, Knight guys, Ultimate shooters, and God knows what else. Everybody thinking there way is best. Sometimes it seems these groups are a lot like churches with the faithful preaching the gospel or condeming the sinners who don't think the same way.



While they're all hashing it out I gotta find all my hunting gear. Got one last season coming up. Now where'd I put my powder?

 

[n8dawg6]

Seems to me "some" of the boys here are just as fanatical about their views on the Savage as the radical traditionalists are in theirs.

Yep. There's radicals in every group who think their way is best. White Boys, savage boys, traditionalists, T/C nuts, Knight guys, Ultimate shooters, and God knows what else. Everybody thinking there way is best. Sometimes it seems these groups are a lot like churches with the faithful preaching the gospel or condeming the sinners who don't think the same way.



While they're all hashing it out I gotta find all my hunting gear. Got one last season coming up. Now where'd I put my powder?

i want one of each.

cabelas doesnt even sell the knight bolt action rifles anymore, or any of the t/c black diamonds. all they have is knight revolutions, t/c omegas, NEF's, and the crappy cva guns. those and the traditional-type italian guns theyve always carried. it seems to me that they've really narrowed their blackpowder product line compared to a few years back. bass pro shops is the same way.

 

[Underclocked]

Let's see, one NEF, two T/Cs, two Whites, and one Knight. Who is RW (the SAVAGE smokeless equivalent of Oral Roberts) referring to? :wink:

 

[Anonymous]

I was hoping you your head felt better :!:

Just between you and me (shhhhhhhh!) I really like my Contender G2 .45. Please do not divulge this to anyone. Yes, I invented the 'Oral Roberts' breechplug-- but the flash hole kept healing itself closed. A pity. :?

Now, Mr. Underclocked, I will send you back to your devious dark mind-shattering conspiracy of unearthly terror that you have unleashed . . . the Crud Ring of ultimate doom and despair.

I train Sea Monkeys professionally. :wink: