Powder measure - by volume - by weight ?

[Mudchucker]

Ive just bought my first muzzle loader TC Omega Z5 -

I bought a field powder measure - brass tube with a plastic sleeve that is graduated and slides in and out and a thumbscrew to set the position.

I was told 777 is the best powder to start with (for all I know it might have been all they had on the shelf)

what are the graduations on the powder measure ? when I set it to 120gr and dump out the powder I have about a hundred grains on the scale (RCBS 5-0-5)

when I squeeze of a round using a weighed out 100 grains of 777 and remove the breach plug I see a pile of un burned powder in the barrel...

of course, I dont know what normal looks like, but my guess is unburned powder is wasted powder...

is there a better powder I should be using ?

how much 777 are folks with the same gun using ?

is the field measure graduated for a different type of powder and as such the graduations are incorrect or is this a volume and weight measurement issue ?

if this is a measure by volume and not by weight, then what does the label on the bottle of powder indicate - volume or weight ?

cheers folks.

 

[cayuga]

The powder measure you purchased measures powder by volume. So if you set the measure to 100 grains and then weigh the charge of Triple Seven from there, it should be around 77.7 grains by weight.

The unburned powder you see when you take the breech plug out is just powder that burned and that is the fouling left. One reason why you should swab the bore of the rifle between shots. Non smokeless powders when they burn are very inefficient. There is normally residue left over after each shot. Different powders leave different amounts.

Triple Seven is a good powder. Just do not load over 120 grains by volume. Also, swab the bore between shots.

 

[txhunter58]

As stated, powder is measured by volume. Basically 100 gr of volume of black powder substitutes is equivalent to the "bang" of 100 gr of real black powder. So when you hear someone say that they used 100 gr, they are talking volume, not weight.

Some people will find a volume measurement that shoots well in their rifle, THEN will measure it one a scale to get the exact amount each time.

The most powder I have ever used in hunting was 110. My current elk load is 95 gr. So don't believe the magnum hype that says you need 150 gr of powder. Anywhere around 100 gr will do the job nicely without breaking your pocketbook or your shoulder. I have tried 120 gr and I am not as accurate because I start flinching.

777 is a great powder. If you are not already, you might try the primers specially made for 777. They will help reduce the "crud ring" that you ares seeing after shots. Omegas are very bad about forming this crud. Makes it harder to load another bullet without swabbing. But as stated, you really need to swab between each shot (a wet patch followed by one or two dry patches).

That said, I now use BH 209 powder. Cleaner burning and doesn't require any swabbing between shots. More expensive though and it sells by the 10 OZ. instead of by the pound. Shoot well out of an Omega as well

 

[onthefarm]

OK, I have a post in the in line forum asking the difference between muzzleloader 209 primers and shotgun, and general consensus was no difference except cost and the purpose was to minimize crud ring using 777.
This isn't a complaint by the way, I really appreciate everyone's opinion on these questions, and learn a lot in the give and take of this forum.

777 I understand gives better velocity using same volumetric charges? And while another selling point is that it doesn't require the cleaning that BP and Pyro needs, to get the best accuracy shot to shot, you should swab between each shot as Cayuga notes above?

 

[txhunter58]

Abosultely! In my Omega, it was really hard to load even a second shot without swabbing and I feel that my accuracy suffered when I didn't swab between each shot.

As far as special muzzleloading 209s like 777 primers, I would have to say that they are worth trying at least once. The "crud ring" caused by 777 in my Omega was really bad and the 777 primers did help some.

But when I tried BH 209 (no swabbing between shots ever, and less corrosive), there was no going back FOR ME. You have to try and use what works for you.

777 was easier to clean than pyrodex (never used real black) and probably less corrosive. It also gives about 15% more power than pyrodex/black for the same volume. However, BH 209 is at least as powerful as 777 if not slightly more.

Again, there is nothing at all wrong with 777, it is a great powder. But in my book, if it works in your particular gun BH 209 has it beat in every category except price.

 

[onthefarm]

Yes, I would like to try BH209, but it is recommended not to use it in the Tracker 209 I have. I actually bought some before I knew that, and it sits in my cabinet waiting for a gun that I can use it in.

 

[txhunter58]

Sorry, I mistook you for the guy who opened this thread with an Omega. That is the other shortcoming of BH 209, will work only in certain guns.

If I was unable to use BH 209, 777 would be my first choice, although I would not hesitate to use pyrodex. Not really that much harder to clean and sometimes is easier to find an accurate load using it.